34. A. It is as thou sayest, and I willingly yield compliance with thine injunctions. But this at least I would entreat, before thou decreest a term to the volume, that thou wouldst summarily explain what the distinction is between the true figure, which is contained in the intelligence, and that which thought frames to itself, which in Greek is termed either Phantasia or Phantasma. R. Thou seekest that which no one except one of purest sight is able to see, and to the vision of which thing thou art but poorly trained; nor have we now in these wide circuits anything else in view than to exercise thee, that thou mayest be competent to see: yet how it is possible to be taught that the difference is very great, perhaps I can, with a little pains, make clear. For suppose thou hadst forgotten something, and that others were wishing that thou shouldst recall it to memory. They therefore say: Is it this, or that? bringing forward things diverse from it as if similar to it. But thou neither seest that which thou desirest to recollect, and yet seest that it is not this which is suggested. Seems this to thee, when it happens, by any means equivalent to total forgetfulness? For this very power of distinguishing, whereby the false suggestions made to time are repelled, is a certain part of recollection. A. So it seems. R. Such therefore do not yet see the truth yet they cannot be misled and deceived; and what they seek, they sufficiently know. But if any one should say that thou didst laugh a few days after thou wast born, thou wouldst not venture to say it was false: and if he were an authority worthy of credit, thou art ready, not, indeed, to remember, but to believe; for to thee that whole time is buried in most authentic oblivion. Or thinkest thou otherwise? A. I thoroughly agree with this. R. This oblivion therefore differs exceedingly from that, but that stands midway. For there is another nearer and more closely neighboring to the recollection and rekindled vision of truth: the like of which is when we see something, and recognize for certain that we have seen it at some time, and affirm that we know it; but where, or when, or how, or with whom it came into our knowledge, we have enough to do to search our memory for an answer. As if this happens in regard to a man, we also inquire where we have known him: which when he has brought to mind, suddenly the whole thing flashes upon the memory like a light, and we have no more trouble to recollect. Is this sort of forgetfulness unknown to thee, or obscure? A. What plainer than this or what is happening to me more frequently?

CAPUT XX. Quaedam vera credimus, quaedam recordamur; quaedam nec sensu, nec phantasia, sed tantum ratione deprehenduntur.

34. A. Ita est ut dicis, et obtempero praeceptis tuis libens. Sed illud saltem impetrem, antequam terminum volumini statuas, ut quid intersit inter veram figuram, quae intelligentia continetur, et cam quam sibi fingit cogitatio, quae graece sive phantasia sive phantasma dicitur, breviter exponas. R. Hoc quaeris quod videre nisi mundissimus non potest, et ad cujus rei visionem parum es exercitatus; neque nunc per istos circuitus aliud quam exercitationem tuam, ut illud videre sis idoneus, operamur: tamen interesse plurimum quomodo possit doceri, fortasse breviter planum facio. Fac enim te aliquid esse oblitum, aliosque te velle quasi in memoriam revocare. Dicunt ergo illi: Numquidnam hoc est, aut illud? diversa velut similia proferentes. Tu vero nec illud vides quod recordari cupis, et tamen vides non hoc esse quod dicitur. Numquidnam tibi cum hoc evenit, omni modo videtur oblivio? Nam ipsa discretio, qua non admittitur quod falso admoneris, pars quaedam recordationis est. A. Ita videtur. R. Tales ergo nondum verum vident; falli tamen decipique non possunt; et quid quaerant, satis norunt. At si tibi quispiam dicat te post paucos dies risisse quam natus es, non audes dicere falsum esse: et si auctor sit cui fides habenda est, non recordaturus, sed crediturus es; totum enim tempus illud validissima oblivione tibi sepultum est: an aliter putas? A. Prorsus consentio. R. Haec igitur ab illa oblivione plurimum differt, sed illa media est. Nam est alia recordationi revisendaeque veritati propior atque vicinior: cui simile est quando videmus aliquid, certoque recognoscimus id nos vidisse aliquando, atque nosse affirmamus; sed ubi, aut quando, aut quomodo, aut apud quem nobis in notitiam venerit, satagimus repetere atque recolere. Ut si de homine nobis contigerit, etiam quaerimus ubi eum noverimus: quod cum ille commemoraverit, repente tota res memoriae quasi lumen infunditur, nihilque amplius, ut reminiscamur, laboratur. An hoc genus ignotum tibi est, aut obscurum? A. Quid hoc planius? aut quid crebrius mihi accidere solet?