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If their things are done well, ours are done badly; but if ours are done well, theirs are done badly. Infants, he says, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind. Do you think this is enough, tell me, to say that they are orthodox, but the matter of ordination is gone and has perished? And what is the benefit of the other things, when this is not strictly observed? For just as it is necessary to fight for the faith, so also is it for this. Since, if it is permitted for everyone to fill his own hands, according to the ancients, and to become priests, let all come forward, in vain has this altar been built, in vain the fullness of the Church, in vain the number of the priests; let us take them away and destroy them. May it not be, he says. You do these things, and you say, May it not be? how do you say, May it not be, when they have happened? I speak and testify, not looking to my own interest, but to your salvation; but if anyone should be indifferent, that is his own affair; if anyone does not care for these things, yet we care; I planted, he says, Apollos watered, but God gave the increase. How shall we bear the laughter from the Greeks? For if they accuse us on account of heresies, what will they not say about these things? If the doctrines are the same, if the mysteries are the same, for what reason does one ruler leap upon another Church? See, he says, that all things among the Christians are filled with vainglory, and love of rule is among them and deceit, strip them of the multitude, he says, cut out the disease, the corruption of the crowd, and they are nothing. Do you wish me to say what they say about our city? how they slander us for our easiness? It is possible, he says, for anyone who wishes to find followers, and he would never be at a loss for them. O the laughter! of how much shame are these things? But there is also another laughter, another shame; If any are caught among us in the most shameful acts, and are about to receive some penance, there is great trembling, great fear from all sides; Lest he leap away, he says, lest he stand with them. For let such a one leap away ten thousand times, and let him be with them, I do not speak of the sinners; but if anyone happens to be sinless, and wishes to change sides, let him change. For I grieve and beat my breast and lament and am cut to the heart, as being deprived of my own member; yet still I do not grieve so much as to be forced to do anything, on account of this fear, of things that are not fitting. 62.87 We do not lord it over your faith, beloved, nor do we command these things despotically; we were appointed for the teaching of the word, not for rule nor for authority; we hold the position of counselors who exhort. The one who counsels speaks his own mind, not compelling the hearer, but leaves him master of the choice of the things said; in these things he is responsible only, if he does not say what occurs to him. For this reason we also say these things, we speak these things, so that it may not be possible for you on that day to say, No one told us, no one gave charge, we did not know, we did not think it was a sin. For this reason I say and testify, that to schism the Church is no less an evil than to fall into heresy. Tell me, if someone being under a certain king, should not attach himself to another king, nor give himself to another, but taking that king's own purple robe and holding it, pulled it all down from the clasp, and tore it into many shreds, would he be punished less than those who attached themselves to another? And what if, with this, seizing the king himself by the throat he were to slay him, tearing his body limb from limb, what penalty would he pay that would be sufficient? But if one who did this to a king his fellow-servant, would have done something deserving of a penalty greater than any; he who slays Christ and tears him limb from limb, of what Gehenna will he not be worthy? Of this one that is threatened? I do not think so, but of another far more grievous. You women who are present (for this fault is mostly among women), tell this example to those who are absent, frighten them. If any think by this to grieve us and to avenge themselves, let them know well that they do these things in vain. For if you wish to avenge yourself on us, I will give you a way by which you will be able to avenge yourself without your own harm; or rather it is not possible to avenge oneself without harm, but yet with less harm;

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Εἰ τὰ ἐκείνων καλῶς γίνεται, τὰ ἡμέτερα κακῶς· εἰ δὲ τὰ ἡμέτερα καλῶς, τὰ ἐκείνων κακῶς. Νήπιοι, φησὶ, κλυδωνιζόμενοι καὶ περιφερόμενοι παντὶ ἀνέμῳ. Ἀρκεῖν τοῦτο ἡγεῖσθε, εἰπέ μοι, τὸ λέγειν, ὅτι ὀρθόδοξοί εἰσι, τὰ τῆς χειροτονίας δὲ οἴχεται καὶ ἀπόλωλε; Καὶ τί τὸ ὄφελος τῶν ἄλλων, ταύτης οὐκ ἠκριβωμένης; Ὥσπερ γὰρ ὑπὲρ τῆς πίστεως, οὕτω καὶ ὑπὲρ ταύτης μάχεσθαι χρή. Ἐπεὶ, εἰ παντὶ ἔξεστι πληροῦν τὰς χεῖρας αὐτοῦ, κατὰ τοὺς παλαιοὺς, καὶ ἱερεῖς γίνεσθαι, παρίτωσαν πάντες, εἰκῆ τὸ θυσιαστήριον ᾠκοδόμηται τοῦτο, εἰκῆ τὸ πλήρωμα τῆς Ἐκκλησίας, εἰκῆ τῶν ἱερέων ὁ ἀριθμός· ἀνέλωμεν αὐτὰ καὶ διαφθείρωμεν. Μὴ γένοιτο, φησίν. Ὑμεῖς αὐτὰ ποιεῖτε, καί φατε, Μὴ γένοιτο; πῶς λέγεις, Μὴ γένοιτο, γενομένων αὐτῶν; Ἐγὼ λέγω καὶ μαρτύρομαι, οὐ τὸ ἐμαυτοῦ σκοπῶν, ἀλλὰ τὴν ὑμετέραν σωτηρίαν· εἰ δέ τις ἀδιαφοροίη, αὐτὸς ἂν εἰδείη· εἰ δέ τινι τούτων οὐ μέλει, ἀλλ' ἡμῖν μέλει· Ἐγὼ ἐφύτευσα, φησὶν, Ἀπολλὼς ἐπότισεν, ἀλλ' ὁ Θεὸς ηὔξανε. Πῶς οἴσομεν τὸν παρὰ τῶν Ἑλλήνων γέλωτα; Εἰ γὰρ ὑπὲρ τῶν αἱρέσεων ἐγκαλοῦσιν ἡμῖν, ὑπὲρ τούτων τί οὐκ ἐροῦσιν; Εἰ τὰ αὐτὰ δόγματα, εἰ τὰ αὐτὰ μυστήρια, τίνος ἕνεκεν ἕτερος ἄρχων ἑτέρᾳ Ἐκκλησίᾳ ἐπιπηδᾷ; Ὁρᾶτε, φησὶν, ὅτι πάντα κενοδοξίας πεπλήρωται τὰ Χριστιανῶν, καὶ φιλαρχία παρ' αὐτοῖς καὶ ἀπάτη, γύμνωσον αὐτοὺς τοῦ πλήθους, φησὶ, τὴν νόσον ἔκκοψον, τοῦ ὄχλου τὴν διαφθορὰν, καὶ οὐδέν εἰσι. Βούλεσθε εἴπω ἃ περὶ τῆς πόλεως λέγουσι τῆς ἡμετέρας; πῶς ἡμᾶς εἰς εὐκολίαν διαβάλλουσιν; Ἔξεστι, φησὶ, παντὶ τῷ βουλομένῳ εὑρεῖν τοὺς πειθομένους, καὶ οὐκ ἄν ποτε ἀπορήσειε τούτων. Ὢ τοῦ γέλωτος! ταῦτα πόσης αἰσχύνης; Ἀλλὰ καὶ ἕτερος γέλως, ἑτέρα αἰσχύνη· Ἄν τινες ἁλόντες παρ' ἡμῖν ἐπὶ τοῖς αἰσχίστοις, μέλλωσιν ἐπιτιμίου τυγχάνειν τινὸς, πολὺς ὁ τρόμος, πολὺς ὁ φόβος πάντοθεν· Μὴ ἀποπηδήσῃ, φησὶ, μὴ μετ' ἐκείνων στῇ. Ἀποπηδήσῃ μὲν γὰρ μυριάκις ὁ τοιοῦτος, καὶ ἔστω μετ' ἐκείνων, οὐχὶ τῶν ἡμαρτηκότων λέγω· ἀλλ' εἴ τις ἀναμάρτητος ὢν τυγχάνοι, καὶ βούλεται μεταθέσθαι, μεταθέσθω. Ἀλγῶ μὲν γὰρ καὶ κόπτομαι καὶ ὀδύρομαι καὶ διαπρίομαι τὰ σπλάγχνα, ὡς οἰκείου μέλους ἀποστερούμενος· πλὴν ἀλλ' οὐχ οὕτως ἀλγῶ ὡς ἀναγκάζεσθαί τι, διὰ τὸν φόβον τοῦτον, τῶν μὴ προσηκόντων ποιεῖν. 62.87 Οὐ κυριεύομεν ὑμῶν τῆς πίστεως, ἀγαπητοὶ, οὐδὲ δεσποτικῶς ταῦτα ἐπιτάττομεν· εἰς διδασκαλίαν λόγου προεχειρίσθημεν, οὐκ εἰς ἀρχὴν οὐδὲ εἰς αὐθεντίαν· συμβούλων τάξιν ἐπέχομεν παραινούντων. Ὁ συμβουλεύων λέγει τὰ παρ' ἑαυτοῦ, οὐκ ἀναγκάζων τὸν ἀκροατὴν, ἀλλ' αὐτὸν ἀφίησι τῆς τῶν λεγομένων αἱρέσεως κύριον· ἐν τούτοις ἐστὶν ὑπεύθυνος μόνον, ἂν τὰ παραστάντα μὴ εἴποι. ∆ιὰ τοῦτο καὶ ἡμεῖς ταῦτά φαμεν, ταῦτα λέγομεν, ἵνα ὑμῖν μὴ ἐξῇ κατ' ἐκείνην τὴν ἡμέραν λέγειν Οὐδεὶς ἡμῖν εἶπεν, οὐδεὶς διεστείλατο, ἠγνοήσαμεν, οὐδὲν ἡγούμεθα τὸ ἁμάρτημα εἶναι. ∆ιὰ τοῦτο λέγω καὶ διαμαρτύρομαι, ὅτι τοῦ εἰς αἵρεσιν ἐμπεσεῖν τὸ τὴν Ἐκκλησίαν σχίσαι οὐκ ἔλαττόν ἐστι κακόν. Εἰπέ μοι, εἴ τις ὑπὸ βασιλεῖ τινι τυγχάνων, ἑτέρῳ μὲν βασιλεῖ μὴ πρόσθοιτο, μηδὲ δῷ ἑαυτὸν ἄλλῳ, αὐτοῦ δὲ ἐκείνου τὴν ἁλουργίδα λαβὼν καὶ κατασχὼν, ἀπὸ τῆς περόνης κατήνεγκεν ἅπασαν, καὶ διέῤῥηξεν εἰς πολλὰ ῥήγματα, ἆρα ἧττον ἂν τῶν ἑτέρῳ προσθεμένων ἐκολάσθη; Τί δέ, εἰ μετὰ τούτου αὐτὸν τὸν βασιλέα ἀπὸ τοῦ λαιμοῦ κατασχὼν ἔσφαττε, κατὰ μέλος διαξαίνων αὐτοῦ τὸ σῶμα, ποίαν ἂν δίκην δοὺς, τὴν ἀξίαν ἔδωκεν; Εἰ δὲ εἰς βασιλέα τὸν ὁμόδουλον τοῦτο ἐργασάμενος, πάσης ἂν μείζονα δίκης εἰργάσατο· ὁ τὸν Χριστὸν σφάττων καὶ διαξαίνων κατὰ μέλος, ποίας γεέννης οὐκ ἔσται ἄξιος; ἆρα ταύτης [τῆς] ἀπειλουμένης; Οὐκ ἔγωγε οἶμαι, ἀλλ' ἑτέρας πολλῷ χαλεπωτέρας. Εἴπατε, ὅσαι πάρεστε (ὡς γὰρ ἐπὶ τὸ πολὺ γυναικῶν τοῦτο τὸ ἐλάττωμα), ταῖς ἀπούσαις διηγήσασθε τοῦτο τὸ ὑπόδειγμα, φοβήσατε. Εἴ τινες ἡμᾶς λυπεῖν καὶ ἀμύνασθαι τούτῳ νομίζουσιν, εὖ εἰδέτωσαν, ὅτι ταῦτα μάτην ποιοῦσιν. Εἰ γὰρ ἡμᾶς ἀμύνασθαι βούλει, ἐγώ σοι δίδωμι τρόπον, καθ' ὃν χωρὶς τῆς σῆς βλάβης ἀμύνασθαι δυνήσῃ· μᾶλλον δὲ οὐκ ἔστι χωρὶς βλάβης ἀμύνασθαι, πλὴν ἀλλὰ μετὰ ἐλάττονος βλάβης·